tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post3211729364373210244..comments2024-02-21T03:20:21.898-08:00Comments on An Inch At A Time: Reflections on the Journey: Statement from Anaheim on General Convention as it draws to a closeSUSAN RUSSELLhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/01795717638621668638noreply@blogger.comBlogger20125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-20411410736151034202009-07-20T17:40:31.342-07:002009-07-20T17:40:31.342-07:00LGMarshall wrote:
Be very clear... the Bible NEVER...LGMarshall wrote:<br /><i>Be very clear... the Bible NEVER approves Slavery.</i><br /><br />Leviticus 25:44-46. If this isn't approval, what is it?WilliamKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14545955266846478775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-8579229845478523172009-07-19T21:37:10.424-07:002009-07-19T21:37:10.424-07:00I am grateful to Susan for allowing this uncomfort...I am grateful to Susan for allowing this uncomfortable debate to unfold on her comments, because I am learning a lot from it about feeling and beliefs from an opposite point of view.<br /><br />I can relate to the feelings deeply. After B033 was passed at GC2006--a symbolic promise to all that we would pause in our slow forward motion to become GLBT inclusive--I felt abandoned by the church I Pat Klemmehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03206542501782835734noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-1047184882077560612009-07-19T21:00:18.271-07:002009-07-19T21:00:18.271-07:00Be very clear... the Bible NEVER approves Slavery....Be very clear... the Bible NEVER approves Slavery. Don't be a Slave to Sin. 'We know that the Law is spiritual; but I am unspiritual, sold as a Slave to sin. I do not understand what I do. For what I want to do I do not do, but what I hate I do. And if I do what I dont want to do, I agree that the law is Good. As it is, it is no longer I myself who do it, but it is SIN living in me. I LGMarshallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04902418111182358582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-11202147032932090662009-07-19T20:14:51.897-07:002009-07-19T20:14:51.897-07:00So, what Ellen is telling us is that about 75% of ...So, what Ellen is telling us is that about 75% of the people in her parish have decided--on the basis of the recent results of TEC's GC--that they no longer believe in Anglicanism. These people have now decided, on the basis of their objection to the full inclusion of LGBT people in TEC that, after all, Anglicanism doesn't have valid orders or a valid Eucharist; they have now realized WilliamKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14545955266846478775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-64190900755469787032009-07-19T16:06:58.063-07:002009-07-19T16:06:58.063-07:00LG, to prejudge an entire group of people whom you...LG, to prejudge an entire group of people whom you do not know by declaring that they all share the same “lifestyle” and politics is, by definition, prejudice. To then declare yourself to be somehow a victim of this group requires some extraordinary mental gymnastics.<br /><br />“I wonder what sin will be held forth as honorable and worthy in the next decades to come?”<br /><br />It’s true the ACuffda51https://www.blogger.com/profile/11395027089123943228noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-58419978463967635562009-07-19T16:03:52.856-07:002009-07-19T16:03:52.856-07:00The more I study church history, the more it's...The more I study church history, the more it's clear that the church ran into trouble when individuals started insisting on their own interpretation of Scripture outside of the church. This sort of thinking has given us nothing but grief and seperation whether we are talking about the schism of 1054, the Protestsnt "reformnation" or the problems in TEC today.<br /><br />I have no Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09331683057307327021noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-81795609489187434742009-07-19T12:59:29.098-07:002009-07-19T12:59:29.098-07:00Sorry, Ellen and LG, that you feel like you have t...Sorry, Ellen and LG, that you feel like you have to leave. I guess your Episcopal Church isn't the same one I've been a member of for 60+ years. We were taught, in Sunday School, that the Bible (a collection of MANY books, some of which were chosen and some left out: The Apocrapha, for instance) was inspired by God and consisted of stories passed from generation to generation, NOT ProudToBeEpiscopalianhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01497636853475836980noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-9800098079772413232009-07-19T08:44:04.959-07:002009-07-19T08:44:04.959-07:00LGMarshall,
If you won't be in the same church...LGMarshall,<br />If you won't be in the same church with me, I wish you only God's blessings as you go elsewhere. You clearly need to belong to a fundamentalist church, and TEC certainly is not that. But I refuse to be silent when you falsely claim that those of us commited to full inclusion of all the baptized forced/pushed you out. You pushed yourselves out by refusing to live and WilliamKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14545955266846478775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-27692846482534550962009-07-18T22:27:53.871-07:002009-07-18T22:27:53.871-07:00Orthodox Episcopalian Christians --don't care ...Orthodox Episcopalian Christians --don't care a whit about your sexual sin per se.<br /><br />What we care about is the Teaching of the Church.(Individual Salvation is NOT heresy.) It's simply wrong to teach that the Bible is up for personal interpretation. <br /><br />It just so happens that these past couple of decades have been dedicated to furthering sexual sin in the Church. <br /><LGMarshallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04902418111182358582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-3314094173918259722009-07-18T22:16:02.140-07:002009-07-18T22:16:02.140-07:00It's not either/or. It's both/and. Why i...It's not either/or. It's both/and. Why is that so hard to deal with? I celebrate my straight friends' marriages. They celebrate mine. All of us want to live to the same standards of fidelity and honor.<br /><br />And if straights are going to argue that WE changed Biblical teaching, let them consider divorce. Jesus said a lot about that. he said NOTHING about us. How many IThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09605163506396013904noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-8462344365785864022009-07-18T21:04:17.505-07:002009-07-18T21:04:17.505-07:00Almost 10 days and the Episcopal Church gets a gos...Almost 10 days and the Episcopal Church gets a gospel of inclusion and rejects exploring ways to express the uniqueness of Christ in a multi-faith society. So we are one out of two - we have the Second and Great Commandment, but we fail on the Great Commission.<br /><br />Well there is always next time!Bateau Masterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17641991475361553674noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-45739319286905463702009-07-18T20:22:28.521-07:002009-07-18T20:22:28.521-07:00Ellen,
Let's be VERY clear about what you are ...Ellen,<br />Let's be VERY clear about what you are saying: if gay and lesbian folks feel welcome in the Episcopal Church, you feel "very unwelcome." Honestly, I don't know what to say to that. It just leaves me with a hard, painful question: REALLY, can't you be in the same church with me?<br /><br />Again, honestly, I don't know what you mean when you say that "WilliamKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14545955266846478775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-14480182603650468922009-07-18T14:49:48.266-07:002009-07-18T14:49:48.266-07:00Ellen, LG is not blunt. He is wrong. Not one of hi...Ellen, LG is not blunt. He is wrong. Not one of his statements has any basis in fact. They have the same credibility as “Obama is not a U.S. citizen.” Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but no one is entitled to their own facts.<br /><br />TEC is not setting aside “traditional marriage” (never mind that many of what we consider the traditional conventions of the Christian marriage ceremonyuffda51https://www.blogger.com/profile/11395027089123943228noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-78965753564163696392009-07-18T11:25:00.970-07:002009-07-18T11:25:00.970-07:00Reading Ellen's comment I feel so many emotion...Reading Ellen's comment I feel so many emotions I don't know what to make of it. Part of the reason I began to feel so uncomfortable in the Eastern Orthodox Church (the church I was raised in, the church I so intimately connected to my Greek heritage) was because so many disgruntled faithful of other denominations began converting. I began to question whether I belonged some place whichKatie Bhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04289697101455460584noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-48906929996709898722009-07-18T09:29:26.400-07:002009-07-18T09:29:26.400-07:00LG is perhaps a bit blunt, but I can't totally...LG is perhaps a bit blunt, but I can't totally disgaree with a couple if his pointa. I too now feel very unwelcome in the Episcopal Church. It's going to be a sad service tomorrow as for a lot of us it may be the last we attened at the parish. Our rector asked us to wait until GC2009 was over before we did anything and now I think the time has come. Many of us will leave now. <br /><br />Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09331683057307327021noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-25151687781652209382009-07-17T21:30:50.203-07:002009-07-17T21:30:50.203-07:00Oh, no, LGM. The Episcopal Church welcomes everyb...Oh, no, LGM. The Episcopal Church welcomes everybody with no dangling under sign. I used to think it read the Episcopal Church welcomes you (unless you're gay), because that is how I felt with B033. But I want you to keep your reasoned voice active in our midst. You can continue to believe what is right for you and I can continue to believe what is right for me, and we can both be Pat Klemmehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03206542501782835734noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-18907351014809488352009-07-17T19:45:29.797-07:002009-07-17T19:45:29.797-07:00LGMarshall,
The Episcopal Church Welcomes YOU... e...LGMarshall,<br />The Episcopal Church Welcomes YOU... even with your sinful denigration of your gay and lesbian brothers and sisters ("pansexual"?).<br /><br />Turning our backs on Israel? (Are you also some kind of hard-core Christian Zionist who thinks that not only should the church be gay-free but that the Holy Land should be Arab-free?)<br /><br />When I read your posts, I move WilliamKhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14545955266846478775noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-63507003446327815812009-07-17T14:52:15.535-07:002009-07-17T14:52:15.535-07:00As we settle into our newly revised religion '...As we settle into our newly revised religion 'GC2009'.... we confirm & believe:<br /><br />-- Individual Salvation is heresy<br />-- Pansexual Leaders govern<br />-- Traditional Marriage has no place in church<br />-- TEC is the 'Gay Church'<br />-- Evangelisim is dead<br />-- Religious rites for pansexuals<br />-- Religious rites for dead pets<br />-- Turning our backs on LGMarshallhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04902418111182358582noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-3630330592658158092009-07-17T14:38:20.317-07:002009-07-17T14:38:20.317-07:00By the way, not that it matters but that marriage ...By the way, not that it matters but that marriage and those children are highly nebulous and hypothetical.Sorry-still a little worried about the evil eye and such.Katie Bhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04289697101455460584noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-21609676.post-14650910449149211802009-07-17T14:36:37.401-07:002009-07-17T14:36:37.401-07:00Congrats! The work that you have done at General C...Congrats! The work that you have done at General Convention is not just a powerful witness to the LGBT community but to the world. My boyfriend and I are an example of this. We just got off the phone with each other (long distance relationships are a wee bit sad)and we were both so happy and excited about what has happend in Anaheim. I feel (for the first time in a long time) like maybe there Katie Bhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04289697101455460584noreply@blogger.com