Monday, February 19, 2007

Primates' Communique Finally Released ...

Just posted to ACNS: The Communiqué Of the Primates’ Meeting in Dar es Salaam

While I commend the whole document to you -- and I have only scanned it so far myself -- these three items toward the end strike me as where some rubber meets some road:
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31. Three urgent needs exist. First, those of us who have lost trust in The Episcopal Church need to be re-assured that there is a genuine readiness in The Episcopal Church to embrace fully the recommendations of the Windsor Report.
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32. Second, those of us who have intervened in other jurisdictions believe that we cannot abandon those who have appealed to us for pastoral care in situations in which they find themselves at odds with the normal jurisdiction. For interventions to cease, what is required in their view is a robust scheme of pastoral oversight to provide individuals and congregations alienated from The Episcopal Church with adequate space to flourish within the life of that church in the period leading up to the conclusion of the Covenant Process.
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33. Third, the Presiding Bishop has reminded us that in The Episcopal Church there are those who have lost trust in the Primates and bishops of certain of our Provinces because they fear that they are all too ready to undermine or subvert the polity of The Episcopal Church. In their view, there is an urgent need to embrace the recommendations of the Windsor Report and to bring an end to all interventions.
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Postscript:

1 - We were told that ENS would have a statement with quotes from +KJS out at 1:40am Tanzanina time but that was over an hour ago ...

2 - Jim Naughton has a nice compilation of "early reactions" over at Daily Episcopalian.

3 - Kendall Harmon "has his hat off" to all who worked so hard ... which is, frankly, never good news for those invested in the full inclusion of all the baptized in the Body of Christ.

4 - My email inbox is full of messages that start, "How could she ..." and "What does this mean ..." and "Why would I stay in a church that ..."

And at the moment, I don't have a single answer for a single one of them.

16 comments:

Dennis said...

Will the Episcopal Church cave in, or will it continue to see us as human beings too and our relationships as worth blessing?

Soon enough (probably before the next GC) there will be same sex marriage in possibly NY and maybe another state. More states will add civil unions. Will these be thrown aside so the straight men in robes can feel that God loves them because they fight against the LGBT community in the church?

I want to hear the PB say very clearly in the next few days, in an unmistakable way, that we have a place in this church and our relationships will still matter and are not "evil" like the traditionalists seem to think.

Someone who knows or talks to our PB please make it clear to her that something needs to come out soon that is loud and clear. Because otherwise we have been thrown under the bus. By our 'friends'.

Susan Russell said...

We hear a quote from the PB is forthcoming in an already over-due ENS release ... stay tuned.

Bill Carroll said...

The goal should be to keep the Episcopal Church moving forward. The Anglican Commitment needs our witness that we will not be intimidated or dissuaded from the process. Either it will catch up with us or it won't. If it doesn't, it isn't worth saving. At the same time, we haven't yet arrived. We haven't yet done enough to become a Church where everyone is welcome. No exceptions allowed.

Virgil in Tacoma said...

If I read the communique ideologically, I am depressed. (If I were conservative, I'd be depressed also). But reading it as a pragmatist, I think if we stay with the big picture, there's a lot of hope for the future here.

The only pragmatic problem I see (and it's a big one) is can much of this be accomplished without a GC response which I believe wouldn't be possible until 2009. Some of it could be handled by the House of Bishops, but not all of it.

Bob said...

I never thought we'd get this far. Although this looks like a step back and is, maybe in giving some we can get some peace and a way forward for GL people in those provinces responsible for curtailing our forward movement.

There is also the fact that TEC has affirmed GL people with the consecration of +Robinson as well as many priest and deacons and through these acts tells others, God loves us and accepts us (well, re affirms for some. I grew up with a lot of self hatred, shame and thought I was damned. With what TEC has done all that has changed (and I'm sure for others too, not just GL Episcopalians).

Let's look at the possibilities and take advantage of them. Listen to God, pray.

Trust God.
Bob

Anonymous said...

Bishop Lee is famous for his "I'd choose heresy over schism" quote. One must consider whether the progressive wing of the church is can tolerate the "heresy" of a less than full inclusion LGBT persons or choose schism. Nothing in Lambeth teachings on sexuality permanently closed to the door. That was what the listening process was about. In this case, I think there was merely overreach on the part of progressives. Just my two cents

Dennis said...

Virgil in Tacoma:

I don't want it handled by General Convention, I want it shut down by General Convention. And by the House of Bishops before this September.

- Dennis in Bremerton

Anonymous said...

So TEC will now be known as the Gay Liturgical Church? Ho Hum.

Where will that leave you in regards to the rest of christendom?

Frair John said...

The ENS statment is about usless, full of platitudes and no meat, and I am sick of platitudes.

John Gibson said...

A coward writes:

"Where will that leave you in regards to the rest of christendom? "

A lot closer to Christ than the likes of Akinola!

The Rev. Robert Semes said...

I think the whole Dar-Es-Salaam "communique"is an insult to gay and lesbian Episcopalians, and the fact that PB Jefferts-Schori appears to have signed on is a further insult. Is she just doing the same trick she did at the General Convention at the last minute? Give me a break! It's enough to make anyone lose their religion...which now isn't a bad idea.

Catherine + said...

++Katharine said upon accepting her election as PB that she would continue to support gays and lesbians in the Church. I don't think she will have been bullied into signing something she does not believe in. I still have great faith in her stand.

Anonymous said...

I'm not sure what this means, but isn't it odd that both sides believe they've lost? Maybe it's a sign that staying together is a lose-lose situation.

It's obvious neither side is going to convince the other. I don't know why this insistence on sticking together. You're all just driving each other crazy. I mean, if it hurts when you do that, stop doing that. IMHO, you should split up, negotiate a property/financial settlement and get on with your lives. Peace out.

Bill @ IndustrialBlog

Anonymous said...

Yes, well, the problem with negotiating a property settlement is that so far, TEC's position is that "It's all ours, get out." They're not interested in negotiating a settlement at all, which seems rather unfair to those congregations where TEC has never put a dime in and in fact has for many years been supported by the congregations whose land they now want to take based on the Dennis Canon.

John Gibson said...

Does anyone know when we might expect a statement out of the PB either confirming or disputing the account in today's NY Times?

Joe Omar Gonzales said...

God loves all of us (The Holy Trinity). I knew from the very firt time on attended worship at All Saints Pasadena (I was going to say walked on to, but I had a paper route there as a paper boy),I was welcomed and for the first time in my life I was accepted now matter who I was or where I was on my journey of faith, and (I just turned 50 yrs. old coming out of a horrific depression, as my first and only partner died of AIDS due to complications of Wasting Sydrome, we were offered so many services (from the All Saints AIDS Service Center), however, I was still working in Corporate Human Resources for a great Healthcare co. (National Medical Enterprises, Inc. for 10 years), my Richard would say oh, no we don't need any food, we have money, no we don't need any help we have plenty, he told me leave it for the ones who don't have much, or the ones who really need it (now Iam crying), I was blessed to be making over $40,000. a year, not bad for a kid who was never raised in one home, or by either parent, and I use to pray every night as a child when I was in the 5th grade, (as my mom had two newborns, beside the others in between) so as a little boy I was changing diapars (no huggies in those days), mom was out drinking, making formula or sometimes giving my baby sister and baby brohter a bottle with water and sugar or water and syrup, (but when I would spend what I now know is quality time grandma Eva told me and taught me so many things, respect my elders, respect women, love my neighbor, and she knew I was gay and many of her other grandchildren also gay, she loved all of us and told us God loved us too. My grandmother (a woman, a lady, a friend, my all in all told me to do the right things and she was raised by Roman Catholic nuns at the Convant of the Good Shepard), well my grandma lived and worked hard in spite of all the prejudice in Pasadena, fighting for "the dirty Mexicans" and the Colored people as they were called in those days. So my grandma lives well with in my soul, she went to heaven on my birthday 2/13 nine years ago, (she was never sick in her life, had a stroke at age 88, and her last year she had no quality of life, I went to see her on my birhtday I held her little head in my arms ever so gently, and thanked her for teaching me about Jesus, about God, how to tie my shoes, how to drive a car, how to be a good person, I told her all of her children were there as well as some grandchildren were there with us as well when actually they were not (they said she was a mean person, she was just strict with good boundries and rules for children), oh, I told her that it was time to go With God now, I told her she would be with her eldest daughter aunt Ida May (nice Mexican name), my uncle Rudy, who (spent most of his last 20 years at Fillmore Park or Memeorial Park and my family said he would be found dead in the gutter, but, he died at grandmas house clean and sober for a month, so how can being gay or being straight or having purple eyes, or green skin how can any of that with someone who has so much love to serve and love the Lord with all their heart have anything to do with "homosexual", we will pray for our Primates, Bishops and Church Leaders, we will not give up, we will love and serve. As I was brought up and raised Roman Catholic, so I was going to hell for everything (I thought), through the many racial, Roman Catholic discrimination, and so on, God has been good to me. I became a productive Human Being, a proud American joining the U.S. Navy, during the Vietnam Era, worked/payed into social security for 30 years, ran marathons, raised money for a friend of mine in Corporate Human Resources who passed of Cystic Fibrosis, raised over $10,000 for AIDS walk Los Angeles, I was also chairman of one of our 3 adopt a schools, Volunteered and always willing to serve (don't worry I am not a saint, however I am a good Human Being "what in the hell does being gay have to do with someone who happens to be a good servant of our Lord", everything I have done in my life has been to and for the honor and glory of God. I even signed up as #28 to ride the very first CA AIDS ride, and my sister Doreen (has rode, trained, volunteered for every single ride about 15 of them now. So if we are good Christians and servants of our Lord, we should only pray that one day all this hate come to a halt! Two wrongs don't make a right, you can not fight fire with fire. It is better to love than hate, let us not lose focus and have anger against these Primates who have hate and discriminate. We will move forward, we will survive, we will love and serve Our Lord with Gladness and Singleness of Heart, and we will still be good role models to children and all whom come into our lives. God has been good to me! Mucho amor por La Susan Russell (another great role model of what is good and right with us "homosexuals" if that is what they want to label us). Via Con Dios, I have health issues, nothing terminal, take several medications, however, through the Grace of God and being led by the Holy Spirit and all the Love we have in Pasadena at All Saints Epsicopal church, I plan on going back to college, finish my B.A. then Masters and my childhood dream may just come true (to end up in law school), is there a law school to end hate? (just kidding). If we ever needed the Lord before we sure do need him now. Peace my brothers and siters no matter what part of the world you come from, no matter your sexual orientation, no matter the shade of your skin, no matter the shape of your eyes, no matter your pains, no matter what you have or don't have. I am living proof, we will survive. Peace, Joe